Curse

joshuarodger · Nov 25, 2008, 03:26 AM // 03:26

This failure of a thread got me to thinking about the pros and cons of gimmicks vs. balanced groups.

Generally with balanced groups, there is room for any profession. If your main is a mesmer you can run something. If your main is a Rit, you can run something. Some professions are a must-have, i.e. monks, but even then you can still run an ether renewal prot/orders ele, hex removal/orders necro, or resto rit to cover some of the monk's duties. Generally, balanced takes a little longer than most gimicks. In some cases, it's not much longer at all, 10-15 minutes. In other cases, depending on the experience of the players in either group, it can take much longer.

Generally with gimmicks, you need to be able to run a select few professions. Ele, necro, monk, mesmer, sin. If your main is a warrior, there's almost no way you will fit into a cry-way group in order to finish DoA and get the statue for your HoM. If you don't have an active guild or friends list, you're really up shit creek. If you can run a cry-way profession, the current meta gimmick, you will be able to join pugs for most any elite area and reap all the rewards, monetary and otherwise, that go along with elite areas.

I have run ursan and cry-way and tank-n-spank (old school) and i have run balanced and in my opinion, I prefer the balanced group that has space for nearly everyone, mainly because I have a lot of characters and it's fun to switch it up every now and then. True, most areas have builds that are more effective for that area and an ele may not be the first choice to take, but we can make it work.

I don't mean this thread to be a "MY WAY IS BETTER THAN YOUR WAY!!!" flame war. i'm actually curious. which do you, individually, prefer? the quick, "get in, get off, get out" method of whatever the current gimmick is? or the more team oriented, "if something goes a little haywire, hopefully we can adapt" method? and why do you prefer that way?

Lyynyyrd · Nov 25, 2008, 03:32 AM // 03:32

Balanced builds involve balancing your party/skills to suit the environment. They are the best build for any given zone.

ALF71BE · Nov 25, 2008, 03:34 AM // 03:34

Balanced (moar liek Physical amirite?) is boring for the bitches (err, casters).

Cryway is also boring, but for everyone.

So yeah, I don't care, because my ranger is often sub-par for such situations.

Otherwise, :3 warriors.

I MP I · Nov 25, 2008, 03:36 AM // 03:36

Well as you should know by now, I prefer the quick, get in, get off, get out method. Oooh yea! All about the rush baby! Balanced builds can also be fast as long as everyone functions as a team and knows what they're doing. I've been in pug groups where people actually failed hard which in turn took forever to complete stuff with cryway. Proof that gimmicks aren't necessarily faster.

Shayne Hawke · Nov 25, 2008, 04:09 AM // 04:09

PuGs can't balance, so of course they'll run FotM. In fact, if I had to PuG, FotM builds are the only things I'd want to touch.

And that's why I never do elite areas.

Lyynyyrd · Nov 25, 2008, 04:18 AM // 04:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by I MP I

Well as you should know by now, I prefer the quick, get in, get off, get out method. Oooh yea! All about the rush baby! Balanced builds can also be fast as long as everyone functions as a team and knows what they're doing. I've been in pug groups where people actually failed hard which in turn took forever to complete stuff with cryway. Proof that gimmicks aren't necessarily faster.

....Gimmicks aren't faster than balanced. But I only play with good players, so yeah.

Arkantos · Nov 25, 2008, 05:00 AM // 05:00

I prefer balanced.

1) All of my professions are welcome
2) All of my friends/guildies are welcome
3) I can run whatever the hell I want
4) Successfully running a balanced build takes more skill than running a gimmick build

-Lotus- · Nov 25, 2008, 05:07 AM // 05:07

balanced build are better and faster. unfortunately people are to stupid to understand how to play them, so they use tanks, or cryway, or ursan.

snaek · Nov 25, 2008, 05:23 AM // 05:23

randomway ftw

Jaran Cell · Nov 25, 2008, 05:27 AM // 05:27

Pug Gimmic > Pug Balanced

Guild Balanced > Pug Gimmic

Luminarus · Nov 25, 2008, 07:12 AM // 07:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaran Cell

Pug Gimmic > Pug Balanced

Guild Balanced > Pug Gimmic

I think you also forgot to mention that Guild Balanced > Guild Gimmic as well.

Katari · Nov 25, 2008, 07:41 AM // 07:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

I prefer balanced.

1) All of my professions are welcome
2) All of my friends/guildies are welcome
3) I can run whatever the hell I want
4) Successfully running a balanced build takes more skill than running a gimmick build

5) If something goes wrong, a balanced build can easily recover.

Tyla · Nov 25, 2008, 07:41 AM // 07:41

I prefer balanced because it doesn't mostly collapse at the death of your tank and the profession availability is practically always complete for any profession. It also helps you get better at the game, whereas if you're nuking what good's that going to do outside of Tank'N'Spank?

upier · Nov 25, 2008, 08:15 AM // 08:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lyynyyrd

Balanced builds involve balancing your party/skills to suit the environment. They are the best build for any given zone.

I thought that the point of balanced was in running a build that is prepared to take down pretty much anything thrown at it. This means that the guys here can not be taken down by surprise appearances.
Compared to a gimmick where the point is to exploit certain circumstances - but at the same time be completely and utterly easily countered?

the Puppeteer · Nov 25, 2008, 08:48 AM // 08:48

as long as there is no pve skill abuse...

MirkoTeran · Nov 25, 2008, 09:22 AM // 09:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by the Puppeteer

as long as there is no pve skill abuse...

Both PvE-only and PvP/PvE split skills are abuse by the very definition and should never been added to the game IMHO. But thats another story.

As to what I play: I played balanced and gimciks... it all depends on my mood. If I had to choose a single one it would be balanced for 2 reasons:
- I find it fun (its a game after all...)
- I prefer builds (and not just in GW) where you don't win simply by pressing 3 keys a fast as you can.

Erys Vasburg · Nov 25, 2008, 12:08 PM // 12:08

I find the term "Balanced Way" offensive. The "way" gets attached to things a lot these days, but it started with IWAY (which makes perfectly good sense considering the skill name). But IWAY was a gimmick. A strong gimmick, a brave gimmick at times... But still a gimmick. Ergo tacking "way" to the end of anything is essentially implying that it is a gimmick by the nature of the term, and balanced builds most certainly are not gimmicks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the Puppeteer

as long as there is no pve skill abuse...

Stick around for a few hours, I'm going to make a thread around here later that focuses precisely on that very issue. Sort of like Faer's, except less full of bait for people to shout "my PvE skill mashing build is better than yours".

fenix · Nov 25, 2008, 12:10 PM // 12:10

I agree with Erys, there's nothing in any of the balanced builds, or even the current gimmicks that involve "Will Avenge You", so why add 'way' at the end?

Avarre · Nov 25, 2008, 12:14 PM // 12:14

Gimmicks rely on a single overpowered mechanic and minmax it to get the most one-dimensional effect. It produces a greater effect for minimum requirement of skill, and is typically shown by high number of a single class/skill in a team lineup.

Anyone who suggests that because they are successful running a gimmick, they are a good player, is not only wrong, but idiotic. Abusing a mechanic does not make you a good player. Reading that thread about how a certain guild was 'good' for being fast with Cry reminded me of, well, any gimmick spike GvG guild that talked tough because they were high on the ladder.

Protip: Every one of them got trampled when it came to tournament play.

I think I'll just start warning for those kinds of posts in the future. I have to maintain some standard of quality, after all. Keep your pathetic guild drama out.

zwei2stein · Nov 25, 2008, 12:24 PM // 12:24

Gimmick - if you don't care about gameplay or having fun and just want XYZ asap.

Balance - if you play to have fun and getting XYZ at end is just bonus.